In this episode we spoke with Shairesh Algoe, the CISO at TM-Pro and advisor of the Dutch Institute for Vulnerability Disclosure. The first CISO in our podcast spoke about his move to the Netherlands to become a CISO, instead of pursuing a career as a heart surgeon. Yet, he has not forgotten his passion for medicine and throughout the conversation he often compares the underlying parallels between our immune system and cyber security. With all his experience in the field he shares insights on product development with a hacker mindset, tips for other CISO’s and what he means with the infinite game in cyber security.